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#51 2016-03-06 20:21:22

SpacePete
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Registered: 2014-03-01
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Re: War on Cash continues

^^^ Making cash use more expensive is one of the proposed techniques for pushing people towards electronic payments, although in this case it could just be management seeing an oppurtunity for a bit of extra profit.


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#52 2016-03-06 21:20:48

FlashInThePan
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From: Australia
Registered: 2011-01-02
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Re: War on Cash continues

Ask Telstra to cite the clause where you have agreed to pay additional for cash payments.

How is it that my offer to pay in full with legal tender could be rejected without an additional fee begin imposed, as payment in full is final.
Please provide a lawful excuse for charging additional for settlement made in  legal tender 'cash' over other forms of payment methods.
Please cite the law or stationary provisions that you are relying on else prove your claim that I gave consent to your presumption that I will be paying for your internal companies administrative functions such as your cash transactions fee over and above the service you provided me. 
I am not aware that I am bound to provide you any capital payment other than for the service you provide me.
I do not have an employment contract with you, however if you prefer me to make payment in a form other that cash then I shall charge you my administrative fee according to my schedule of $100 per electronic transaction to meet your requirements.  If you do not accept cash then we have agreement to my terms.

Last edited by FlashInThePan (2016-03-06 21:27:02)

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#53 2016-03-06 21:35:56

SpacePete
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Re: War on Cash continues

FlashInThePan wrote:

Ask Telstra to cite the clause where you have agreed to pay additional for cash payments.

You even pay $2.20 now for Telstra to print you their bill.

Imagine going to the supermarket and paying an extra $2 for paying the cashier in cash and maybe another $2 for the receipt.


Catus amat piscem, sed non vult tingere plantas

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#54 2016-03-06 21:40:33

Ipv6Ready
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From: North Sydney
Registered: 2016-01-08
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Re: War on Cash continues

If someone pays by a middle man or post office than there would be extra charges. I can't see why the post office would work for free?

You either pay at the branch, send a cheque or money order, or telstra online to avoid paying fees to Telstra.


WTB 4 to 6 grams of pure gold. Don't care if it is coin, bar or granules. Near spot, suits anyone who has been tempted to open a certicard or just have some granules to make a ring

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#55 2016-03-06 21:51:35

SpacePete
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Re: War on Cash continues

Ipv6Ready wrote:

If someone pays by a middle man or post office than there would be extra charges. I can't see why the post office would work for free?

You either pay at the branch, send a cheque or money order, or telstra online to avoid paying fees to Telstra.

You pay a $1 fee for sending a cheque too.

Also other payment fees:



MasterCard, VISA and America Express: 1% + GST

Diners Club: 2% + GST

All debit cards: 1% + GST

https://www.telstra.com.au/support/cate … essing-fee

Last edited by SpacePete (2016-03-06 21:54:15)


Catus amat piscem, sed non vult tingere plantas

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#56 2016-03-06 22:07:22

sammysilver
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Re: War on Cash continues

I think you can pay at a Telstra Store for free.


The price we pay for the good life is public servitude.

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#57 2016-03-06 22:12:31

SpacePete
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Re: War on Cash continues

sammysilver wrote:

I think you can pay at a Telstra Store for free.

Apparently not:

Telstra Store

You can pay in person at any Telstra Store using cash, cheque, debit card or credit card. A debit card and credit card payment processing fee applies for debit card and credit card payments. Also, a $1.00 fee (Incl GST) applies for bill payments made in person, some exemptions may apply.


Catus amat piscem, sed non vult tingere plantas

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#58 2016-03-06 22:17:13

sammysilver
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Re: War on Cash continues

SilverPete wrote:
sammysilver wrote:

I think you can pay at a Telstra Store for free.

Apparently not:

Telstra Store

You can pay in person at any Telstra Store using cash, cheque, debit card or credit card. A debit card and credit card payment processing fee applies for debit card and credit card payments. Also, a $1.00 fee (Incl GST) applies for bill payments made in person, some exemptions may apply.

A bit vague. The $1 fee may be arbitrary.


The price we pay for the good life is public servitude.

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#59 2016-03-06 22:29:42

FlashInThePan
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From: Australia
Registered: 2011-01-02
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Re: War on Cash continues

SilverPete wrote:
FlashInThePan wrote:

Ask Telstra to cite the clause where you have agreed to pay additional for cash payments.

You even pay $2.20 now for Telstra to print you their bill.

Imagine going to the supermarket and paying an extra $2 for paying the cashier in cash and maybe another $2 for the receipt.

That is an contractual offer (based on there company policy) but you have your own policy as remember you are a corporation too and prefer them to bill you in the "ordinary" or "customary" way.
If agreement cant be found then I guess the settlement is made in legal tender to the full amount not including the additional fee. 
You can not be compelled to have a credit a card so the additional fee on cash would be a form of negative discrimination.   As a publicly funded corporation, require you not to discriminate unless you provide a lawful excuse.

Last edited by FlashInThePan (2016-03-06 23:05:39)

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#60 2016-03-06 22:37:17

FlashInThePan
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From: Australia
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Re: War on Cash continues

Ipv6Ready wrote:

If someone pays by a middle man or post office than there would be extra charges. I can't see why the post office would work for free?

You either pay at the branch, send a cheque or money order, or telstra online to avoid paying fees to Telstra.

The kind of arguments that throw this nonsence.
They are claiming there is additional work in handling cash over electronic transactions.  My position is that it is more expensive and complicated to use electronic transactions given the equipment, Internet connection, training, computer software and risks ect.  That cash additional handling fees may be used to subside those costs.  Provide certified accounting that that is not the case.
Sorry those fees you claim as mine are yours to absorb as it is your business.

They claim that cash is more risky to theft.  I claim that my identify theft is far more concerning to me, that you as a business need to manage your risks accordingly.  My business is not your business. Show me your policy that you or anyone else in the payment transaction chain does not retain my private, personal and confidential data.  Sign a declaration to that affect and I shall consider your offer electronically else I pay in cash now.

Last edited by FlashInThePan (2016-03-06 23:13:03)

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#61 2016-03-10 05:47:47

systematic
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Re: War on Cash continues

Bangladesh loses $100m to hackers

"The Bangladesh central bank is working to recover about $US100 million ($A134 million) allegedly stolen by Chinese hackers from an account at the Federal Reserve Bank of New York.

Authorities have given few details about how the money disappeared, but Finance Minister AMA Muhith says authorities are considering suing the US bank over the money's apparent transfer to accounts in the Philippines.

Muhith said the US bank had "no way to avoid their responsibility".

The New York Fed put out a brief statement through its Twitter account on Monday, saying: "Regarding hacking reports, there is no evidence of attempts to penetrate Federal Reserve systems & no evidence Fed systems were compromised."

Offices of the bank, one of 12 US federal banks across America, were closed at night and officials were not immediately contactable for further comment.

The Bangladesh Bank said it managed to recover some of the money but gave no details.

It has also tracked down the money still missing and is working with the anti-money laundering agency in the Philippines, which has been ordered by a court in the country to freeze the accounts while the issue is being investigated.

Bangladesh was also working with World Bank cyber and forensic experts, the bank said in a statement.

The country's leading Bengali-language Prothom Alo newspaper reported on Wednesday at least 30 transfer requests were made February 5 using the Bangladesh Bank's SWIFT code, out of which five succeeded in effecting transfers.

Economist Mamun Rashid, who previously headed Citibank NA in Bangladesh, said he was sure the country would be able to recover the full amount.

"Bangladesh is a client of the Federal Reserve Bank. They must take the responsibility for this incident," he said.

"But we have to see whether we have lodged our complaint properly."

Since hacking has been a threat for years, he said clients should not suffer if depositing with large banks."

http://www.news.com.au/world/breaking-n … 1b919f425c

There is no war on cash ... just shady banks pretending they can be trusted ...


if everyone is thinking the same, we aren't thinking very much ...

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#62 2016-03-10 05:52:28

systematic
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Re: War on Cash continues

"transfer requests were made February 5 using the Bangladesh Bank's SWIFT code, out of which five succeeded in effecting transfers"

There are easy ways to cheat the SWIFT system ... and insiders know it and do it ...


if everyone is thinking the same, we aren't thinking very much ...

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#63 2016-03-17 19:10:46

sammysilver
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Re: War on Cash continues

I believe all Telstra in Goulbourn is down. Good luck to the retailers with EftPos on Telstra ADSL.


The price we pay for the good life is public servitude.

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#64 2016-03-17 19:31:40

JulieW
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From: Australia
Registered: 2010-10-14
Posts: 11,086

Re: War on Cash continues

Medibank claim. Completed 9 days ago. "Your refund should appear in two days time".
Nine days later. Nothing. Off to local Medibank Office.
"Banking Glitch" say clerk.

Welcome to "Brazil"

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#65 2016-03-18 16:17:59

projack
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From: Brisbane
Registered: 2009-08-12
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Re: War on Cash continues

As they finally figured out in Sweden thousands of elderly and handicap people won't be able to handle cashless digital transaction only in their dally life.


The US dollars and Treasury debt called "risk off" because the global fiat system can only survive as long as that remains the case.

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#66 2016-03-18 17:31:06

Stoic Phoenix
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Re: War on Cash continues

JulieW wrote:

Medibank claim. Completed 9 days ago. "Your refund should appear in two days time".
Nine days later. Nothing. Off to local Medibank Office.
"Banking Glitch" say clerk.

Welcome to "Brazil"


Comparing one payment not received in your bank to the conditions that occurred in Brazil would be like comparing a splinter to a fatal shrapnel wound.
If an acorn falls on your head dont tell me the sky is falling.

Last edited by Stoic Phoenix (2016-03-18 17:34:41)


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#67 2016-03-18 21:14:53

JulieW
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Posts: 11,086

Re: War on Cash continues

'Brazil' - referring  to the Terry Gilliam film with a dystopian 1984 society run by a massive and inefficient bureaucracy.

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#68 2016-03-18 21:33:46

willrocks
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Re: War on Cash continues

Black economy: cash-only the rule for businesses avoiding GST payments

6641_cashless.png
Source: SMH


"You can ignore reality, but you cannot ignore the consequences of ignoring reality." - Ayn Rand

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#69 2016-03-18 21:41:48

willrocks
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Re: War on Cash continues

Moving closer and closer to negative interest rates = Moving closer and closer to a cashless society.

Cashless future will save billions and requires red tape abolition: Alex Hawke

    No small change: moving to a cashless society is the next step
    Not making cent: why the humble five cent coin is dommed

Australia's unstoppable march towards a cashless future will save billions of dollars and force governments to abolish outdated red tape, the Assistant Minister to the Treasurer, Alex Hawke, says.

"Australia is well on the way to becoming a cashless society," Mr Hawke has written in an opinion piece for Fairfax Media.

"Like the change to decimal currency 50 years ago, the move to a cashless society will be a fundamental shift in the way Australia's payment system operates."

Mr Hawke urged that government must keep pace with this consumer and business-driven shift in the way Australians do commerce.

"In the face of this change, the government will need to be nimble, removing obsolete regulations and ensuring that innovation isn't stifled by ill-considered interventions," he said.

From 2007 to 2013, cash dropped from 70 per cent to 47 per cent of transactions. In the last three years, the demand for coins has dropped 25 per cent.

"On the 50th anniversary of decimal currency it's only natural to consider what the next 50 years will bring for the Australian dollar, especially as new payment technologies become ever more common," Mr Hawke says.

Last week, Mr Hawke and Ross MacDiarmid, chief executive of the Royal Australian Mint, predicted the five cent coin will be abolished or die off naturally in the near future.

The demand for banknotes is still growing. As of June 2015, there were 1.3 billion in circulation. The total value of $65.5 billion was up 8 per cent from the year before - higher than expected.

This was largely driven by production of the $100 note, which increased 11 per cent and has jumped significantly since 2012.

The Reserve Bank - responsible for banknotes - is evidently backing their future, currently building a new, state of the art printing facility in Craigieburn, Victoria.

Mr MacDiarmid says that, while hard currency is under threat from new technology, "there will always be a need for coins and notes."

He observes that Europe has seen a 5 per cent increase in demand for coins, something not occurring in Australia although there has been a small and mysterious upturn this year.

In a climate of economic uncertainty, there is also concern about the security and lack of anonymity of new innovations. Mr MacDiarmid sees a correlation between this and a preference for coins and notes that people can hold in their hand.

Some countries are leading the charge towards cashless systems. The Danish government has proposed removing the obligation for businesses to accept cash payments and in Sweden hard cash represents just two per of the economy as card and mobile payments take over.

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/ … mv8ka.html

Last edited by willrocks (2016-03-18 21:42:16)


"You can ignore reality, but you cannot ignore the consequences of ignoring reality." - Ayn Rand

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#70 2016-03-18 21:45:13

willrocks
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Re: War on Cash continues

Cash by Optus band vying for a spot on smart wrists
1458092340610.jpg
Rather than reach into your pocket, the Cash by Optus band lets you pay at the counter with a wave of your arm.

Mobile payments are all the rage but is there room for yet another high-tech band on your wrist?

Now that everyone who wants a smartphone already has one, gadget makers are trying to convince us that reaching into your pocket is passé. Forget phones, wearables are the must-have tech – although between fitness bands and smartwatches there's not a lot of wrist real estate left to fight over.

Cash by Optus is the latest piece of tech vying for pride of place on your arm, although it won't tell you the time or track your heartbeat. Instead it's equipped with an NFC contactless payment chip – compatible with Visa payWave – so you can spend up to $99 at the counter with just a flick of your wrist.

The Cash by Optus band is rather big and ugly considering that it only serves one purpose – removing the need to reach for your wallet or phone when you want to pay at the counter. If wearing any kind of fitness band makes you feel like you're under house arrest then you might not warm up to the Cash by Optus band.

Honestly I don't think reaching into your pocket or bag is as much of a hassle as people make it out to be, but there's a big push to convince digital hipsters that cash is no longer cool. You still have to queue at the counter to pay, it's not like an NFC wristband lets you jog past and simply wave at the cash register.

When relying on mobile payments you can also be hampered by the minimum purchase limits enforced by many small businesses to help cover the cost of their credit card facilities. Some people like to whinge about this, but you have to remember that merchant facilities aren't free and it costs a business to accept cards rather than cash.

Smart bands aren't for everyone but the Cash by Optus band does have a few things working in its favour. Firstly, it's free for Optus customers. Optus originally promised a contactless payments smartwatch, which was on show at last year's Mobile World Congress. The watch may still be on the roadmap, Optus tells me they're still considering it, but I doubt they intended to give it away. Starting with a free band seems like a smarter move considering that many people interested in this kind of tech have probably already invested in a smartwatch or at least a smart ecosystem.

Thankfully you're not wedded to the chunky Optus band either. It's possible to slip the NFC chip out of the band and attach it to something else – although Optus doesn't actually recommend using it this way. It doesn't require recharging, because it's only a passive NFC chip like those built into card credits, so it's never going to run flat. You don't even need your phone nearby to make purchases.

One of the major differences to most mobile payment options is that the Cash by Optus band isn't linked to your credit card. Instead it acts like a separate Visa Prepaid debit card. You're also issued with a card number so you can use it for online shopping.

You top-up your account using the smartphone app and it holds up to $500. This will offer peace of mind for some people, especially if you're concerned about losing the band or having someone rip it off your wrist. If your band falls into the wrong hands you can disable it using the app or else call Optus and report it lost or stolen just like any card.

Other people will find pre-paid a hassle and perhaps wish for the convenience of linking it to a credit card, especially as it can take a few days for your top-up transfer to arrive. Thankfully you've the option to set up auto top-ups to ensure you're not left in the lurch.

If you're not sold on wearables you can opt for a Cash by Optus SIM card, which has been around for a few years and is compatible with some NFC-ready Android phones. Alternatively there's an NFC-enabled sticker to whack on the back of just about any phone. Most banks offer something similar these days.

Whether or not you'd find the Cash by Optus band useful all depends on how often you make sub-$100 purchases and whether those stores will  accept a payWave transaction if you're only buying something small like a coffee. If you really do find it a burden to reach into your pocket several times a day, and you're happy to jump on the wearables bandwagon, then the Cash by Optus band might be a welcome addition to your wrist.

http://www.smh.com.au/technology/gadget … njzu6.html

Last edited by willrocks (2016-03-18 21:45:49)


"You can ignore reality, but you cannot ignore the consequences of ignoring reality." - Ayn Rand

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#71 2016-03-18 22:38:43

Mintaka
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Registered: 2012-12-12
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Re: War on Cash continues

War on Cash  equals War on Liberty.  Ugh.


Rest In Peace, Amjad Mohammed Ben Sasi. May your name live long and true in a world full of lies.

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#72 2016-03-18 23:27:10

SilverDJ
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From: Australia
Registered: 2014-11-01
Posts: 2,527

Re: War on Cash continues

I am surprised at how many small businesses openly flout GST rules. From takeaway restaurants that only accept cash

I love how they are presumed guilty until proven innocent roll
There is no legal requirement on a business to accept credit cards. In fact it can be a PITA.

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#73 2016-03-19 01:27:00

willrocks
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Re: War on Cash continues


"You can ignore reality, but you cannot ignore the consequences of ignoring reality." - Ayn Rand

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#74 2016-03-19 01:35:17

willrocks
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Re: War on Cash continues


"You can ignore reality, but you cannot ignore the consequences of ignoring reality." - Ayn Rand

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#75 2016-03-28 12:15:35

willrocks
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Posts: 7,628
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Re: War on Cash continues

We need to scrap the $100 note because they're mainly used in illegal activity

My parents always taught me that it's impolite to talk about money. But it's time to break that dinner party taboo to address the big problems being wrought by big banknotes.

Last year the Reserve Bank of Australia reported an 11 per cent surge in demand for the $100 banknote. Yet, even with 300 million of these bills already in circulation, few Australians ever see our largest bill. Even fewer ATMs actually dispense them.

The reality is that high denomination notes play a tiny role in most legitimate economies. Indeed, the Boston Federal Reserve revealed that only 5 per cent of American consumers use $100 notes. A similar story is likely true in Australia.

A team of researchers, including me and others at Harvard University, worked with Standard Chartered's former CEO, Peter Sands, to outline the troubling role high denomination banknotes play in facilitating illegal money flows. Anonymity of payments and the ubiquity of acceptance make large notes particularly attractive for those engaged in illegal activity. Big bills are now central to the drug trade, tax evasion, money laundering, organised crime and terrorist financing.
...

http://www.smh.com.au/comment/we-need-t … ns3ba.html

Last edited by willrocks (2016-03-28 12:15:52)


"You can ignore reality, but you cannot ignore the consequences of ignoring reality." - Ayn Rand

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