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#1 2013-02-18 11:25:18

errol43
Silver Stacker
From: Bundaberg
Registered: 2010-04-13
Posts: 6,330
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What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

Thanks to John Howard, Kevin Rudd and of course Julia Gillard, going by tonights 4 Corners, It seems like we are going to buy a lemon for big $$$$.. Every one of them backs the F35.

Australian Taxpayers will be paying for this mistake for many years to come.

Why didn't the USA let us have some F22's?.. There is only one country in the world that the USA sold the F22 to and I don't think that they helped out in Americas wars of the 21st century.

Now an election is due, what about these new subs we need at any cost. I know it will create jobs for SA and Vic but is that the only consideration taken into account when buying defence equipment?  The last lot we built were a load of crap..Sweden has a great sub which runs on compressed air. Even the Americans were impressed by its performance!  Why not buy some of these subs?

What do you fellows think of the F35?

Regards Errol 43

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#2 2013-02-18 11:29:45

errol43
Silver Stacker
From: Bundaberg
Registered: 2010-04-13
Posts: 6,330
Trades :   

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

^^^^Have a look at this video on the F 35

Regards Errol 43

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#3 2013-02-18 12:16:16

Golden ChipMunk
Member
From: Perth, Jupiter, Venus, Mars
Registered: 2012-12-12
Posts: 6,733
Trades :   256 

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

R we purchasing secondhand stuff¿
They cost alot. How many have we have.
Cos we s**kup to the us. Wat a lot of cr*p
Is it really a necessity?


Original Perth CAPSULES - All Sizes Available
Full/ Half SOVEREIGN caps, contact Chip wink

Please leave pm , I will reply back  wink Chip

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#4 2013-02-18 13:24:47

Holdfast
Member
From: Australia
Registered: 2009-10-15
Posts: 8,292
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Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

We have to ask, what is the threat for the next 30 years?

Perhaps we need an aircraft that can support joint operations with our allies because, on our own, we could have the best plane and best pilots but we would be snuffed-out very quickly by any of the Super-Powers.

If things got so bad that we had to defend Australia from an land invation from a Super Power, there's not much we can do.

If on the other hand, we continue to support our Allies, we need an aircraft to support the expected threat.

Think about the actual threat we have in this country, and what future operations we will be involved in, as part of Multi International force.

H

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#5 2013-02-18 14:47:24

bordsilver
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From: The rocks
Registered: 2012-05-23
Posts: 9,610
Trades :   36 

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

RE The Swedish subs. They are "brown water" not "blue water" subs. Hence they are suitable for patrolling etc near European coastlines but aren't suitable for operations that require them to be at sea for extended periods - eg running from Perth to, say, the Timor sea. Fundamentally we are a maritime nation that needs to defend shipping lanes and that basically requires a blue water sub.

As demonised as the Collins Class have been in the paper unless we move to nuclear powered subs ( which is what every other navy with long range subs have done) then there simply isn't anything equivalent to the Collins. It really pushed the boundaries of conventionally fuelled subs.


The only good tax is a repealed tax.

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#6 2013-02-18 16:37:31

Earthjade
Member
From: AU
Registered: 2011-08-03
Posts: 928

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

The F-35 is a trillion dollar mistake the US can't admit to, so the hole they're digging for themselves is getting deeper and deeper.
But that's what you get for thinking one basic airframe could replace purposes of all the others currently in service.


Just because something is inevitable, doesn't make it imminent.

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#7 2013-02-18 18:49:06

doomsday surprise
Silver Stacker
From: El Dorado
Registered: 2011-12-15
Posts: 1,365
Trades :   20 

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

Seriously, why does Australia need submarines? The collins class sub is a POS and we can't staff them. More pointless government expenditure.
The F35 is another turkey. What about the sea sprite helicopter? When was the last time we had a credible defense minister?

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#8 2013-02-18 18:49:57

CriticalSilver
No longer active
From: Australia
Registered: 2010-12-10
Posts: 2,784

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

Recognise it for what it is. It's just a tax. Protection money.

Here are the published US exports to Australia by value (up to 2011):
http://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/sta … c6021.html

From the published statistics, the sum of military type imports (bottom of the table) exceeds the imports of gold. Yes, apparently the second largest producer of gold in the world imports "non-monetary gold" from the USA!

Australia was the United States= 14th largest goods export market in 2011.
http://www.ustr.gov/countries-regions/s … /australia

And if you are wondering what the trade gap is between the two countries, it turns out in 2011 Australia imported about twice as much from the USA as it exported to it.
(exports are listed here: http://www.dfat.gov.au/publications/tra … 2011.html)

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#9 2013-02-18 18:59:23

lucky luke
Member
From: Qld
Registered: 2011-05-15
Posts: 1,907
Trades :   17 

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

Gino wrote:

Recognise it for what it is. It's just a tax. Protection money. ...............

And if you are wondering what the trade gap is between the two countries, it turns out in 2011 Australia imported about twice as much from the USA as it exported to it.
(exports are listed here: http://www.dfat.gov.au/publications/tra … 2011.html)

Thanks Gino. You've brought it back to the basics.
That's a sobering statistic.


In the world of perception management "Beliefs are stronger than facts".

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#10 2013-02-18 19:08:27

Au-mageddon
Member
Registered: 2012-01-14
Posts: 1,818
Trades :   55 

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

lucky luke wrote:
Gino wrote:

Recognise it for what it is. It's just a tax. Protection money. ...............

And if you are wondering what the trade gap is between the two countries, it turns out in 2011 Australia imported about twice as much from the USA as it exported to it.
(exports are listed here: http://www.dfat.gov.au/publications/tra … 2011.html)

Thanks Gino. You've brought it back to the basics.
That's a sobering statistic.


Free trade agreement at its best mad

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#11 2013-02-18 19:16:15

lucky luke
Member
From: Qld
Registered: 2011-05-15
Posts: 1,907
Trades :   17 

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

Au-mageddon wrote:
lucky luke wrote:
Gino wrote:

Recognise it for what it is. It's just a tax. Protection money. ...............

And if you are wondering what the trade gap is between the two countries, it turns out in 2011 Australia imported about twice as much from the USA as it exported to it.
(exports are listed here: http://www.dfat.gov.au/publications/tra … 2011.html)

Thanks Gino. You've brought it back to the basics.
That's a sobering statistic.


Free trade agreement at its best mad

Yes but how many of Australia's citizenry (the enlightened people who "vote" in our wonderful democracy) see the word "free" in "free trade" and automatically think we got something wonderful in our favour? The Free Trade agreement was just another nail putting us even further under the control (domination) of our real masters. And few people actually see it for what it really is.

where's the sarcasm tag when you really need it??!! Hows that bloody petition going?!

Last edited by lucky luke (2013-02-18 19:17:33)


In the world of perception management "Beliefs are stronger than facts".

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#12 2013-02-18 20:41:55

Holdfast
Member
From: Australia
Registered: 2009-10-15
Posts: 8,292
Trades :   

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

Part 1


Part 2

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#13 2013-02-18 20:47:48

salty lemon
Guest

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

At least Australia has decided to go with a mixed fleet now. 10 years ago our official line was all F-35's.

I think we should scrap the F35 until they are ready and properly tested, whenever that may be

#14 2013-02-18 20:57:17

salty lemon
Guest

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

.... It's funny, the F-35 project is such a big multinational project with top secret departments that this thread will be read 100% lol

Hi military spooks!  big_smile

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#15 2013-02-18 21:00:39

scone
Silver Stacker
From: Under Downunder
Registered: 2012-03-15
Posts: 1,623
Trades :   50 
Website

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

salty lemon wrote:

.... It's funny, the F-35 project is such a big multinational project with top secret departments that this thread will be read 100% lol

Hi military spooks!  big_smile

good opportunity to tell them their plane is shite then.

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#16 2013-02-18 21:33:09

lucky luke
Member
From: Qld
Registered: 2011-05-15
Posts: 1,907
Trades :   17 

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

sconejon wrote:
salty lemon wrote:

.... It's funny, the F-35 project is such a big multinational project with top secret departments that this thread will be read 100% lol

Hi military spooks!  big_smile

good opportunity to tell them their plane is shite then.

Per chance, is it the same mob who are trying to get that Dreamliner thing into the air?


In the world of perception management "Beliefs are stronger than facts".

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#17 2013-02-18 22:40:05

jparrie
Member
From: Australia
Registered: 2011-04-12
Posts: 812

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

This is a Lightening:

The F35 is a Lemon.

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#18 2013-02-18 22:41:07

Austacker
Member
From: The Wild West
Registered: 2010-02-26
Posts: 2,898
Trades :   56 
Website

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

I watched a doco on the US choosing the fighter. The key was the vertical take off. For them that meant it could be used across all their bases.

I didn't like the one they chose, I preferred the other one. This was in 1996 so already 22+ years old ?

Here are a couple of links to the history of the JSF that I found.

http://www.jsf.mil/gallery/gal_photo_cd … gc-bae.htm

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articl … est-10148/

http://www.jsf.mil/history/his_jsf.htm

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#19 2013-02-18 23:02:33

Jislizard
Silver Stacker
From: Australia
Registered: 2011-04-07
Posts: 7,479
Trades :   57 

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

Is it worse then the eurofighter? 

All I can remember from the eurofighter is that it cost way more than it was estimated, took far longer and at the time was considered to be a massive waste of money and just an attempt to curry favour with our (UK) new European friends.


Now stacking: World Junk Silver Coins.
Swap your older, worn, dirty fractional silver coins for fiat, .999 rounds or legal tender. 
Individual coins, mixed lots or bulk. 
Not looking for Australian, bent, holed or damaged coins, thanks!

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#20 2013-02-18 23:19:26

Yippe-Ki-Ya
Banned
From: The Land of Guilty by Default
Registered: 2011-02-23
Posts: 5,892
Website

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

Holdfast wrote:

We have to ask, what is the threat for the next 30 years?

95% of the threat we face is just being overrun by economic migrants, commonly referred to as "assylum seekers" who arrive unannounced by boat.

Last edited by Yippe-Ki-Ya (2013-02-18 23:23:46)


mmm....shiney! wrote: House prices are the leading indicator of what???????????

Yippe-Ki-Ya wrote: gubmint meddling  lol

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#21 2013-02-18 23:21:05

bordsilver
Silver Stacker
From: The rocks
Registered: 2012-05-23
Posts: 9,610
Trades :   36 

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

Yippe-Ki-Ya wrote:
Holdfast wrote:

We have to ask, what is the threat for the next 30 years?

95% of the threat we fact is just being overrun by economic migrants, commonly referred to as "assylum seekers" who arrive unannounced by boat.

Definitely need F35's for that. We should order 200 of the suckers tongue


The only good tax is a repealed tax.

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#22 2013-02-18 23:23:06

Yippe-Ki-Ya
Banned
From: The Land of Guilty by Default
Registered: 2011-02-23
Posts: 5,892
Website

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

doomsday surprise wrote:

Seriously, why does Australia need submarines? The collins class sub is a POS and we can't staff them. More pointless government expenditure.
The F35 is another turkey. What about the sea sprite helicopter? When was the last time we had a credible defense minister?

I agree (for once) with you.

all we really need in terms of naval defence are ships that can turn back assylum seeker boats!!
nothing more, nothing less...


mmm....shiney! wrote: House prices are the leading indicator of what???????????

Yippe-Ki-Ya wrote: gubmint meddling  lol

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#23 2013-02-18 23:40:44

hawkeye
Silver Stacker
From: Perth, Australia
Registered: 2010-11-10
Posts: 3,337
Trades :   25 

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

Who are we under threat from?

The ocean surrounding us acts in a similar way to a moat around a castle, except much more effective.  We only need a basic defence really.   If the biggest world military power in the world can't successfully invade and secure countries when it has bases in adjoining countries that it can use for a ground attack and resupply then what hope has any country got of invading us when it has a huge ocean to contend with?  Not to mention the international outrage that such an action would bring.

Maybe we have better things to spend the money on than pointless jets.  Maybe the tax money that would be used should instead be refunded so it can be spent in the economy instead.

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#24 2013-02-18 23:45:33

Yippe-Ki-Ya
Banned
From: The Land of Guilty by Default
Registered: 2011-02-23
Posts: 5,892
Website

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

The only thing our navy seems to be good for is rescuing/picking up assylum seekers to add to our list of dole bludgers ...

Like we dont have enough home-grown ones, so lets just go to Indonesia and "rescue" some more there...

WOOHOO!! The more the merrier! lol


mmm....shiney! wrote: House prices are the leading indicator of what???????????

Yippe-Ki-Ya wrote: gubmint meddling  lol

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#25 2013-02-19 00:01:03

alor
Silver Stacker
From: Pulau Alor ;)
Registered: 2011-06-16
Posts: 4,541
Trades :   39 

Re: What a Price To Pay for F35 Fighter!

Yippe-Ki-Ya wrote:

The only thing our navy seems to be good for is rescuing/picking up assylum seekers to add to our list of dole bludgers ...

Like we dont have enough home-grown ones, so lets just go to Indonesia and "rescue" some more there...

WOOHOO!! The more the merrier! lol

You need a much bigger boat, I will lend you my flag, on the sea... lol

need a dock or middle of the sea transfer are good. lol

payment in silver bullets, big ONES tongue


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